shaktazuki Sep 24, 2008 1:22 am
Subject: Re: max file formats

Wow. Gus wrote back. He said he probably doesn't remember much, but I went ahead and asked him this:

Quote:
Is the source code accessible? I understand Interplay still holds copyrights to it - is there someone in particular I should talk to?

Do you have any recollection of the algorithm used for distributing resources on the world maps? I have been able to strip some information out of maxrun.exe, but don't know what it means:

raw_normal_low
0
raw_normal_high
5
raw_concentrate_low
13
raw_concentrate_high
16
raw_concentrate_seperation
23
raw_concentrate_diffusion
6
fuel_normal_low
2
fuel_normal_high
3
fuel_concentrate_low
12
fuel_concentrate_high
16
fuel_concentrate_seperation
24
fuel_concentrate_diffusion
5
gold_normal_low
0
gold_normal_high
0
gold_concentrate_low
10
gold_concentrate_high
16
gold_concentrate_seperation
32
gold_concentrate_diffusion
5
mixed_resource_seperation
40
min_resources
9
max_resources
20

Related to that, do you recall the algorithm for determining infiltrator success at disabling / capturing for units (which appeared to be modified depending on the unit / building type and whether you were capturing disabled/undisabled units) and experience gains? I know from the executable the standard infiltrator starts with 50% chance of success - at what, though, it doesn't say - and goes up 10% per successful attempt at something...

And, how did the alien unit experience work? For some number of kills, pick one random stat and increase it by a percentage? Or was the trigger something other than kills?

Is there any accessible documentation on the file formats involved, such as the world maps (.WRL), and the resource packs (.RES), as well as the demo file (.DMO)?

It would be soooo cool if he knows any of this stuff.

shaktazuki Sep 24, 2008 8:20 am
Subject: Re: max file formats

I think this was helpful!

Quote:
I doubt anyone knows where the source is now. Interplay of course owns the rights, but I suspect they haven't made an effort to preserve it.

I only vaguely recall the resource placement. I think you can ignore the "normal" numbers. Originally the entire map was going to have low levels of resources, and that's what the "normal" values refer to. The concentrate numbers are all that remain. The "low-high" values are a simple random range. Seperation is the rough distance, in squares, between deposits. Diffusion is a measure of how many squares a deposit occupies.

I don't recall how infiltrator experience worked.

Alien experience was based on kills, I believe. And no, it wasn't random. Rather, it used a mechanism similar to the unit upgrades. That's as much as I recall.

We had pretty much no documentation for file formats, ever. Like many projects, we simply added code to read / write sections of the file as we went. Since no other application needed to know how to write those file formats, there was no formal doc.

Sal Sep 24, 2008 11:22 am
Subject: Re: max file formats

yeah that´s not bad, nice he wrote back and took the time to do so. good work shaktazuki!

for the alien experience, they get updates on the things they "do"
If it´s alot under attack, it will gain defense ( shield & hit points)
It seems to be a rather simple system, but yeah, an index file with, "when and how"- what happens, is of importance here.

You are really eager to make your own 1to1 MAX Clone aren´t you? Grinning


beko Sep 24, 2008 3:16 pm
Subject: Re: max file formats

It's nice to see somebody digging into that stuff Smiling

shaktazuki Sep 24, 2008 7:08 pm
Subject: Re: max file formats

Quote by Sal:
You are really eager to make your own 1to1 MAX Clone arenĀ“t you? Grinning

Cool

Yes!

I'm also talking with Interplay to see if the source code still exists.

I'm in the middle of researching how to implement a MVE player using SDL. I found someone who's quite knowledgeable about the format.

With what Gus told me, I think I might be able to come up with a reasonable approximation of the original resource distribution algorithm.

I have a disassembler, but maxrun.exe is so big it doesn't help much (and I haven't done anything with assembly language since the University).

Sal Sep 24, 2008 7:34 pm
Subject: Re: max file formats

Sounds pretty cool, how far is your own MAX?
It looks like you are very fundamental and constructing in a very systematic way, I am impressed so far ( the fact that you try to clone it to the max is reason enough Grinning )

shaktazuki Sep 24, 2008 8:43 pm
Subject: Re: max file formats

I'm not far at all; I haven't started coding the actual game yet, just thinking a lot about how the algorithms might work and what features I want to have. I also have to figure out how to use SDL - for that, I have done some experimentation with audio in preparation for implementing the MVE player.

I have to re-teach myself how to program because I haven't done any programming in the 5 years since I got my degree in computer science.


Sal Sep 24, 2008 9:25 pm
Subject: Re: max file formats

now that sounds nice Grinning
how old are you and where are you from?

shaktazuki Sep 24, 2008 11:23 pm
Subject: Re: max file formats

I'm 33, from Southern California, just a bit north of Los Angeles. How about you guys?

Sal Sep 25, 2008 12:08 am
Subject: Re: max file formats

I will speak for me Laughing

I am 25, living and going to school (again- lucky xD ) in Mönchengaldbach, Germany.
I am very dedicated fan of MAX... beko even said " He is the reason why this all started " ..and well, yeah that true.. Grinning
cause I wanted more than a side with some text..i wanted a MESSAGE BOARD!

Yeah, what else... MAX is a huge godlike game for me. I love it, like Grim Fandango... its so deep and magic..dunno how to say that.
I can speak english out of games and ze inetrnets lol
I researched the original M.A.X. alot. I dont have any developer skills at all, but I have the ability to research stuff... even if its with a hex editor ( like for the M.A.X. save files ^^ )
Tried to exchange the MAX.res files with the one from the demo´s and all.. I do alot "try & error " let´s say it that way.

I hate to lose in M.A.X. XD An old friend plays with dirty tricks..! ..like one awac one awac lol..he is a skillfull crazy dude, and shoots up everything he can lol

I know, I abuse this thread.. but hey, it´s fun so far.
I modelled a lot of 3d stuff for fun long long time ago. They used a simple "buidi up" system for the models, so you can start with default objects and rebuild it.

And I am only "watching" the MAX R process, cause for me, its still far from the original game ( rules and stuff )...and if it still crashes online.., well I can have that too with the original M.A.X.
Truth is, I could help more to get a better version, to fix bugs and so on. But there was alot of work, bypassing the actual game, that disturbed me. Especially the similarity is very important for me. I might get on the train, supporting, but I still dont know.

yeah that was all I wanted to say ... dont get angry with me xD

sal